Why is it that Aussies don't seem to like women at their tables?

by Gabby on 09/02/07

Perhaps another title might be ...

Was there a better way I could of handled this?

Okay, here goes ...

I was in Vegas back the end of June, first part of July, trying to win my way into the WSOP events, including I'd hoped the one on June 30th at noon (no, I didn't play after all, in part for reasons you'll see below (I didn't get my goal of making more money for the buy in)).

I decided to build my bankroll which isn't what I'd hoped it would be by playing in the Binions Classic event on June 29th, at 2pm, the buy in was $150 bucks, with no rebuys.

We had about 500 players, and I was doing pretty good, the table was nice, and actually quite chatty for a mostly male table (I was the only woman there), we are only 40 off from the money, and I am in the big blind.

Previous to this hand, the player to my right had been knocked out.

The blinds are 1600 and 800, ante is 200, and the UGT opens up the pot for 5k which is over half his stack, and I have about 13k left (he has 9k left).

When it comes to me I look down and see pocket 10's, and I go all in.

UTG (who is a nice kid), thinks for a moment, and says he callls.

He turns over pocket jacks, and I know I'm in deep dodo, and I'm right, as I get no help on the flop, river or turn.

Now, towards the end of this, this jerk of a young kid (I'd say he was about 21 or 22 yrs of age) from Aussie land comes over with his stack and as we soon find out, he is very drunk.

(Think of that kid on last years (the 2006) WSOP that was drunk, being a pain, and times it by four, and you got a picture of this kid).

He's loud and obnoxious and zero's in on me, starts poking at my chips and says in a loud voice, I'm gunna take you out, you don't belong here, then slugs the last of the drink he brings to the table with him, and starts yelling Cocktails (like he really needs more)!

He then turns his attention back to me and starts barraging me, I try to ignore him, but the more I try the louder and more obnoxious he gets.

The next hand comes and I'm in the Small blind, he announces to me and the rest of the table that he's gunna keep raising until he can rid the table of me.

Sure enough he does raise, but I have nothing, so I fold.

Next hand after that, he makes a small raise, again I have nothing, but a person after that does, raises, and another goes all in.

Dummy from Australia and the other player calls. During the hand the Aussie keeps telling the other guy, just check it down so we can get this other guy out, at each turn, dummy says it again loudly.

After the hand is over, I point out to him (as he's getting on my last nerve here) that while many players do this, to say it out loud is considered collusion, and that he shouldn't be doing that.

In the end, the all in player survives, and dummy starts in again with me. He then shoves his drink holder into my space, my chips go flying, and I tell him, to move it. He then takes it and puts it over in a guy I've come to know as Andy, space (a really nice guy as well), who is to this loudmouth Aussie's right, and starts yelling for the cocktail waitress again.

I can see on Andy's face he is stunned and doesn't know how to handle it. For me this is even more truly amazing, the shocked look on Andy's face, as I've been trying for hours to get a read on him, and his face has been like stone. For Andy's face to show that much emotion, well, I know that he's stunned as well.

I have had enough, I call the floor, and complain, tell them what has happened thus far, including how the Aussie was telling the other guy what to do in the middle of a hand with an allin player in.

The floor (a guy by the name of Alan who is the on duty floor) gives him a warning, tells him he'll have to forgo a round of play if someone complains again.

Next hand, it comes around to me, and I'm very short stacked, and I look down and see Ace/10, it's not the best hand in the world, but for someone who is short stacked, it's an okay hand IMO, and I'm only a few places off from the button.

It goes around and besides the blinds, we get 1 other caller, big mouth decides to fold, and I go all in.

He then starts in again, saying oh I should of called, I wanted to be the one to take you out.

In the mean time it's going fold fold fold, and I'm hoping everyone will fold their hand and I can pick up the blinds and antes.

It gets to the player who limped in preflop, and loudmouth starts telling him, call her, you know you want to call her!

The guy thinks about it, starts to move his cards again to the muck, and then the Aussie starts in again and says, come on buddy, do it for the table, get rid of this woman! The guy thinks again, and says, Okay I will call her.

Now I'm really ticked off, he's doing it again, and worst of all, it is affecting me! Only reason I didn't call the floor in the middle of this exchange, is that I didn't want to give away the strength of my hand.

I turn over my A/10 o/s, and the guys turns over Q/J o/S.

Flop comes 10/king, 8, rainbow.

Now the dummy loudmouth Aussie (who's not even in the hand) starts chanting, give us an ace, give us an ace, we want to get this woman out of here!

Turn is a blank for both of us, but on the river, comes a 9, giving the other guy a queen high straight, and I'm out 30 spaces from the money.

(BTW, I had established myself as a good, tight player, so when I went all in or raised the table pretty much folded until this jerk came along)

dummy loudmouth starts cheering, saying that's the way to do it, we now have no more women at the table! yeah!

I'm furious now, and I call over the floor, tell them what happened, and they make him sit out a round. I also tell them they need to cut him off since that is what I suspect is driving this fool (they tell me that they can't cut off a player for any reason).

I've never had this happen this badly before, ever since I first started playing poker 4 years ago, where I was at a table with someone who had such hatred for women, and especially not by someone this young.

Normally if something started, all it took at most is one call to the floor to get it to stop.

Is there anything I could of done differently, and what can be done about obnoxious drunks who zero in on you just because you're the only woman at the table?

In addition, I later came across this similar attitude over at the Orleans event, by someone who was also an Aussie, who seemed to resent my being there at the table as him.

Is there something in the Aussie Culture where they don't think women belong at the poker table, or what?

Comments anyone?

9 Comments

Comments

lakeoffire says

I can't really comment on the Aussies behavior (drunken idiots) but I do think women still have some obstacles to overcome at the poker table. My wife plays poker and sometimes comes with me to the casinos. From the first time she played I have noticed that things are different for her. Our first time out we sat at the same table and I don't think everyone knew we were together and before long I noticed this drunk guy staring at her, really staring at her. I wanted to see how she handled herself so I didn't interfere (not then anyway) when he started talking to her and making her uncomfortable, as if your first time at a poker table isn't freaking enough to make anyone shit themselves.

When the seat opened up next to her I wasn't prepared for what the drunken idiot would do next. He stood right up and moved to the chair next to my wife. I really can't convey to you how creepy this guy was--I liken him to someone who had pets as a child but killed them because he pet them too hard. He kept leaning into her space and showing her his cards, and of course still staring constantly at her (you could actually see his dirty thoughts). The whole table was watching this idiot make his play on a ball that was completely out of his league.

I finally stand up when my wife finally looked at me with a "help me" look on her face (I was chomping at the bit for an hour or so). I walk over to the guy and say " HEY, CREEPY GUY, GET UP AND GO BACK TO YOUR SEAT. THAT IS MY WIFE". He stares at me for a few seconds and I think we are going to throw which I am more than happy to (because I have other interests besides poker :). He recognizes things are about to get ugly and goes to sit down like a good boy while I explain to him she is here to play poker and not to be bothered by drunken creeps.

I love poker and would love for my wife to enjoy the same experiences that I do. This blog caught my eye after seeing situations occur with my wife that would never happen to me. You did all you could do with the problem at hand and maybe next time the floor will be a little more helpful.

The point to the story is that I assured my wife things would be fine when we played live and most people would treat a woman player with respect. I was angry that her first time playing live turned out to be a bad thing. It is easy for me at a table to say shut the F up to an ass at the table, but it's a totally different thing for a woman. In summation, I would say I have far more good experiences playing poker than bad ones. Boys will be boys (whatever that means) but hopefully you will run into a few more "men" in the future. Good luck at the tables!
LoF

09/02/07

EdmondDantes says

Wow, sorry you guys have had those experiences. FWIW, I think most guys would actually speak up in similar circumstances. I was at a table at the Hustler when a guy was making off-color comments to an attractive Asian girl at the table. After his second comment, I and others came down on him pretty hard and he shut up after that. In the future, immediately call for the floor and insist that they shut him up. If the floorperson doesn't respond, call for a supervisor. Trust me, they prefer people to enjoy themselves and will take action if you simply say, "This player's trying to influence hands he's not in and making sexist comments." Be nice but firm and if they don't take action, don't patronize them anymore. There's plenty of card rooms/tournament venues that want your business.

09/02/07

TylerDurden says

Edmond has it nailed on the head; call the floor, and insist on the rules. In addition, regarding the "we can't cut a player off for any reason," comment by the floor -- pure crap. Unless Nevada's laws about alcohol are completely and totally unlike those of any other state that I'm familiar with (NY, TX, FL, VA, and NC), the person serving the alcohol can be held liable if a drunken patron winds up hurting themselves or others (eg, in a car accident). I know from first-hand experience -- being at the table when it's happened, I don't drink when playing poker -- that casinos (at least in in NV and FL) DO in fact cut people off when they've had too much (and, in at least one case, offer the drunk a room to sleep it off in!).

09/03/07

Bond18 says

Hmm, well i live in Australia and over all its a somewhat more chauvinist country than the US but rarely as overtly as this.

Stories like this amuse me, i can't tell you how many times i've had American women tell me how much more "charming and polite" foreign men than Americans. I die a little inside everytime i hear a woman say that. AH HAHA! Nothing could be further from the truth, in the vast majority of countries the gender inequality is way more pronounced and the men are the same old sleaze, often worse.

Next time you run into a rude aussie tell him "Your as stupid as a fucking kiwi and twice as ugly." That'll tell 'em.

09/03/07

lakong says

I hate reading this story. Sorry for your experience. However, I need to point out that drunks come in all shapes and sizes and from all continents. Have you had bad experiences before with Australian men? I've seen this type of behavior with American men, British men, etc. Not sure why you are generalizing here.

Now for your experience. It sucks and I have seen it before. I'm surprised that someone else at the table didn't stand up for you. You need to be pro-active here and ask for help from the floor as soon as it happens. You should probably also make it a point to let them know that you are even more upset than you are and that you feel sexually discriminated against and if they don't take a stand that they are contributing to the behavior. Believe me, they will take action very quickly. They should have actually waited at the table for a few hand to watch it. I've seen people complain about drunken, abusive behavior like this many times (not necessarily against women) and at all times the floor watched the action for a while. If this happened in your situation, the final hand would not have happened the same way.

I also don't think it would have been a problem to say something during the hand in question. If you did it right, it probably wouldn't have effected the action. You could have said 'I'm happy to have a call or fold, but let the guy make his own decision.' It does suck the way it ended up. Sorry for your experience.

And welcome to the site. We would love to hear more from you!!! Did you play other events at the WSOP? How often do you play, do you have future plans to play in large buy-in events?

* Bond18, a regular blogger on this site, lives in Australia and is quite charming!

09/04/07

Gabby says

What made me wonder if it was Aussies in general, is because when I was playing in the Orleans event a week or so later, I ran into the same type of attutude (only he wasn't so 'out there' and he was sober), and found out the guy was from Australia.

Normally, I'm like most American women, and I love how the Aussies and Brits gents talk (I find it quite sexy to be honest). I guess I was just floored by all of this, as here in the states, you might come across this attutide in American men, but normally it's more likely to be in the Baby boomer generation or older.

Never had I found this type of attitude in a guy so young.

As for WSOP events, well, later I cashed at a Binions daily tourney for just under 2k, and tried to play a Sat to the WSOP ME.

Sadly, my pocket jacks got sucked out on the river when the guy who went all in with his pocket 10's rivered a 10 for trips.

So, I never made it this year to the actual WSOP, but maybe next year. I was cash short because I've been facing on and off unemployment, and I work in the Telecom Sector which has been hard hit here in the states. I moved to Colorado back in March of 2006 to take a job here, but my house back in Ohio sat on the market for over a year before it sold. It only cost me 30k USD in real time money (not a paper loss, but real money) to sell it (ouch!). I only sold it because it was costing me $1400 USD every month to hold on to it.

After I paid off all my bills and such after the house sold, I really didn't have a lot of extra money saved up this year to play in the WSOP events, unless I won the money elsewhere (Hence the reason why I was playing at the Binions Classic event, in the hopes of winning my buyin to a WSOP event).

I really like this blogging site, as it's very easy to use, so I hope to post more blogs as time goes on. There is another blogging site out there that is more in use right now (MissT74 uses it) among poker players, but it's so darned hard to use, I gave up on trying to use it.

I plan on recommending this website to all my friends, and to the female poker players who frequent the women's poker forums.

I have won events before (largest one was a Charity event back when I lived in Ohio, for a GP of 10k), and have cashed many times including coming in 13th in event #1 of the Ceasars Indiana WSOPCE this past March.

I currently live in Colorado, the land of no fold 'em Hold 'em, aka as Bingo Poker (I hate it here because of that).

The Heartland Poker Tour (a televised event much like the WSOP and WPT, but on a smaller scale, with smaller buy ins - http://www.heartlandpokertour.com ) is coming to our area in October, and I am looking forward to it and dreading it at the same time.

This is because the max bet here is only 5 bucks, so the top cash game is 5/5 Limit, dealers choice. Most here though, play 2/5 Limit, and it sucks. I get more playing time out of slot machine here, than I do playing live action poker.

Bad thing is, this kind of attitude (play any two cards to the river) carries over into the Tournament play as well.

Normally you have to raise 5 or 6 times the blinds to get people to fold their hands preflop, and if you don't do that, then they will suck out on you big time.

I'd like to one day come and play in the Aussie Millions, but after what I experienced with the Aussies recently here in the States, I'm beginning to wonder if I'm asking for trouble by doing so.

For those of you in Australia, are there many women out there in Australia playing at the tables, or are women few and far between there?

09/04/07

Anonymous says

I've played many times in Australia and never had a problem. I was actually commented to some friends a few weeks ago that I found the players to be among the most friendly to women around. I played the Aussie Millions the past two years and several other times just played while visiting some friends. Compare that to the Los Angeles casinos where I'm frequently insulted and hit on. The Hollywood Casino is the worst by far, but I've had bad times at the Commerce, the Bike and Hustler too. My worst experience ever was at the Palms during the World Series. Maybe I'll sign up here and write about it. Not sure if I want to relive it though.

09/04/07

lakong says

Gabby, I'm assuming the 'other' blogging site you're referring to is blogger.com (blogspot). It's owned by Google. While it's a really popular blogging site and is packed with features, it really doesn't compare with tworags in one critical way. This is a poker site. When you blog here, thousands of poker players will read your blog. On blogger you are on your own. The only people who read your blog are people who you tell about it or who search for your name in Google.

On tworags your entries show up on the blogging page PLUS we often put interesting and new blog summaries on the homepage so everyone can find them. If your blog entries are entered as trip reports and linked to a casino, then your entries are also cross-references from the casino's listing.

We certainly hope you make this your own and we appreciate it if you recommend the site to friends.

Another advantage is that you get to talk directly to the owners (I'm one of them) and suggest changes and new features. We're here to listen and welcome your feedback. Really!

- S

09/04/07