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Archive May 2009: verneer
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Playing two tables of HU
by verneer on 05/21/09
... and getting berated in both chats at the same time. Read the chat. Ship it!
Also - with regards to my comment in chat. This is the "professional play" I made:
http://www.pokerhand.org/?4239485
Yes, I had a read, yes, I was trying to tilt him, and no, this is not standard for me. Basically, I like it when these types of players feel I'm a massive donkey so they keep playing and hopefully reloading. So in chat I say things which make me sound clueless ("I had a pair!") or straight up ignorant ("Professional players make plays like this").
I will post my HU results sometime in the next few days ...
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Pawel Nazarewicz (Verneer) is a guest pro at Cardrunners.com. Visit cardrunners and sign up for their industry-leading coaching videos.
Poker Reciprocity - Part 1
by verneer on 05/15/09
I love thinking about reciprocity as it relates to poker. Tommy Angelo talked a lot about it in his Elements of Poker book and I want to give a few examples in this blog and the next few. First of all, let's look at Tommy's definition:
"Reciprocity says that when you and your opponents do the same thing in a given situation, no money moves, and when you do something different, it does," said Angelo. Over time, you and your opponents will see every hand in every position. When you and your opponent each picked up AA UTG, who scooped a bigger pot? When each of you had those same aces cracked from the button, whose stack took the bigger hit?"
Let's start with this example and discuss how to determine the winner of the hand in terms of reciprocity:
First of all, you can see how the hand went down, and I was clearly the winner at the end. But let's look at the overall tally street by street:
Pre-flop: MarcD2k6 picks up Kings and raises them on the button. I certainly would have done the same thing in his shoes. Now, on my end, calling 44 from the SB vs. an unknown button open will probably be a losing play in the long run. Folding would have been ok, 3-betting an unknown SB/BTN with 44 is probably the worst option.
Edge: MarcD, but not big.
Flop: I check, and on a Q44 board with a flush draw, he fires a pretty big continuation bet. I would have also c-bet this board as it's a great one to do it. On my end, I decide to c/c and imagine he would have done the same thing.
Edge: Neither - it's a wash.
Turn: The turn brings the 9c putting a straight draw and a flush draw out there. There is $9 in the pot and he fires close to pot. I probably would have bet a bit smaller, but I like his bet size. At this point, I felt that by raising I'm representing a monster and put him on a hand like AQ or KQ. I think he can get away from the hand if I raise here (Beluga Theorem), so I decide to just call again and hope for a blank river.
Edge: Neither - it's a wash.
River: The river is perfect - an off-suit deuce. I check and he bets big - about $21 into $25. In his shoes, I would have also put i a good value bet. I shove and he calls for an extra $16. He's gotta figure he's beat by then, but he's pretty pot committed. Not value betting the river would have been crimial though.
Edge: Once again, feels like a wash.
So - post-flop I would have played the hand the same way that he did, so I don't get any reciprocity points for it. Feel free to critique any street by either of us to deterimne if either of us misplayed any street based on what we knew at the moment (since it was my 2nd hand at the table, it was pretty much played in a vacuum).
So what did we learn from this hand? I don't think he learned too much about me (other than the fact I slow-play quads) and I didn't learn anything about him as I would have done what he did. So ... not much information is exchanged either.
In my next blog, I'm going to examine a hand where I felt I won some serious reciprocity points and examine why.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________
Pawel Nazarewicz (Verneer) is a guest pro at Cardrunners.com. Visit cardrunners and sign up for their industry-leading coaching videos.
"Reciprocity says that when you and your opponents do the same thing in a given situation, no money moves, and when you do something different, it does," said Angelo. Over time, you and your opponents will see every hand in every position. When you and your opponent each picked up AA UTG, who scooped a bigger pot? When each of you had those same aces cracked from the button, whose stack took the bigger hit?"
Let's start with this example and discuss how to determine the winner of the hand in terms of reciprocity:
First of all, you can see how the hand went down, and I was clearly the winner at the end. But let's look at the overall tally street by street:
Pre-flop: MarcD2k6 picks up Kings and raises them on the button. I certainly would have done the same thing in his shoes. Now, on my end, calling 44 from the SB vs. an unknown button open will probably be a losing play in the long run. Folding would have been ok, 3-betting an unknown SB/BTN with 44 is probably the worst option.
Edge: MarcD, but not big.
Flop: I check, and on a Q44 board with a flush draw, he fires a pretty big continuation bet. I would have also c-bet this board as it's a great one to do it. On my end, I decide to c/c and imagine he would have done the same thing.
Edge: Neither - it's a wash.
Turn: The turn brings the 9c putting a straight draw and a flush draw out there. There is $9 in the pot and he fires close to pot. I probably would have bet a bit smaller, but I like his bet size. At this point, I felt that by raising I'm representing a monster and put him on a hand like AQ or KQ. I think he can get away from the hand if I raise here (Beluga Theorem), so I decide to just call again and hope for a blank river.
Edge: Neither - it's a wash.
River: The river is perfect - an off-suit deuce. I check and he bets big - about $21 into $25. In his shoes, I would have also put i a good value bet. I shove and he calls for an extra $16. He's gotta figure he's beat by then, but he's pretty pot committed. Not value betting the river would have been crimial though.
Edge: Once again, feels like a wash.
So - post-flop I would have played the hand the same way that he did, so I don't get any reciprocity points for it. Feel free to critique any street by either of us to deterimne if either of us misplayed any street based on what we knew at the moment (since it was my 2nd hand at the table, it was pretty much played in a vacuum).
So what did we learn from this hand? I don't think he learned too much about me (other than the fact I slow-play quads) and I didn't learn anything about him as I would have done what he did. So ... not much information is exchanged either.
In my next blog, I'm going to examine a hand where I felt I won some serious reciprocity points and examine why.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________
Pawel Nazarewicz (Verneer) is a guest pro at Cardrunners.com. Visit cardrunners and sign up for their industry-leading coaching videos.